Garry Wills

  • Aired:  02/11/13
  •  | Views: 46,794

Gary Willis, the Pulitzer Prize-winning author, talks about transubstantiation, Catholic priesthood and all the trouble that comes from the book of Hebrews. (5:28)

>> Stephen: WELCOME BARK EVERYBODY.

MY GUEST TONIGHT SAY PULITZER PRIZE WINNING AUTHOR WHOSE NEW BOOK IS CALLED WHY PREACH.

ANSWER: CAUSE GOD.

PLEASE WELCOME GARRY WILLS.

BOOM.

BOOM.

MRS. WILLS -- MR. WILLS, THANK YOU FOR JOINING AMERICA IT'S ALL CATHOLIC ALL THE TIME TONIGHT.

>> YES.

>> Stephen: YOU ARE A PULITZER-PRIZE WINNING AUTHOR OF MANY BOOKS INCLUDING "WHY I AM A

CATHOLIC" "PAIPEL SINS" AND "LINCOLN AT GETTYSBURG." YOUR NEW BOOK IS CALLED "WHY

PREACH: A FAILED TRADITION." WHAT DO YOU MEAN FAILED SNL IT'S BEEN OVER THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

WHAT IS FAILED ABOUT THAT?

>> WELL, THEY CONTINUE TO PRETEND TO TURN BREAD AND WINE INTO THE BODY AND BLOOD OF JESUS

WHICH DOESN'T HAPPEN.

>> Stephen: YOU HOLD IT RIGHT THERE, BUDDY?

ARE YOU A CATHOLIC?

>> YES.

>> Stephen: YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN IT?

>> WAS AUGUSTINE A CATHOLIC.

>> Stephen: EARLY CATHOLIC HADN'T DEVELOPED YET.

THIRD CENTURY.

>> HE SAID IT'S RIDICULOUS THAT WE EAT GOD, DIGEST GOD AND EXCREATE GOD.

SAID THE BODY OF CHRIST IS US, THE FOLLOWERS OF JESUS.

>> Stephen: OF COURSE, YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT.

IF WE TAKE THE EUCHARIST WE BECOME THE BODY OF CHRIST.

>> WE DON'T CONSUME HIM, HE CONSUMES US.

>> Stephen: HE SAID THIS IS MY BODY THIS, IS MY BLOOD.

>> THERE HE WAS IN HIS BODY.

HE SAID EAT THIS BRED, IT'S MY BODY.

HE DIDN'T SAY TAKE A CHUNK OUT OF MY ARM OR TAP MY BLOOD.

[LAUGHTER]

>> Stephen: IF JESUS IS IN HEAVEN AND ON EARTH HOW CAN THEY BE IN TWO PLACE AS THE ONCE.

>> IT'S THE TRIN JIT A MYSTERY.

>> Stephen: THE EUCHARIST IS ALSO A MYSTERY.

>> NO, IT'S A FAKE.

[ LAUGHTER ]

>> Stephen: LET'S GET BACK TO PRIESTS.

>> YES.

>> Stephen: SURELY YOU HAD SOME GOOD EXPERIENCE WITH PRIESTS.

>> MANY.

>> Stephen: ARE YOU CALLING THEM FOOL?

>> THEY ARE BROTHERS IN CHRIST AS LONG AS THEY DON'T PRETEND TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE THEY DO

WONDERFUL THINGS.

>> Stephen: CHRIST ROSE FROM THE DEAD.

>> YES.

>> Stephen: HOW CAN YOU ACCEPT THAT AND NOT ACCEPT THAT GOD CAN WORK THROUGH THE PRIEST TOP

TRANSSUB STAN SHIITE.

>> NOTHING IN THE BIBLE --

>> Stephen: UPON THIS ROCK I BUILD MY CHURCH AND THE GATES OF HELL SHOULD NOT PREVAIL AGAINST IT.

>> THAT DIDN'T SAY HE WAS A PRIEST.

[ LAUGHTER ]

>> Stephen: NO BUT ST. PAUL SAYS THOU ARE A PRIEST FOREVER --

>> THAT WAS NOT ST. PAUL.

>> Stephen: THAT'S NOT PAUL?

>> NOBODY KNOWS WHO WROTE IT.

IT'S A MYSTERIOUS ANONYMOUS DOCUMENT.

>> Stephen: ISN'T IT IN THE BIBLE?

>> YES.

>> Stephen: THEN GOD WROTE IT.

[ LAUGHTER ]

OKAY.

[ LAUGHTER ]

>> YOU ARE RIGHT IT'S FROM THAT EPIVOTEL OF -- EPISTLE OF HEBREWS.

SINCE JESUS COULDN'T BECOME A PRIEST IN JEWISH LAW THEY SAID, WELL, THERE WAS A PRIEST OF HIGH

GOD AND ABRAHAM OFFERED HIM A TITHE AND SO JESUS WILL BE IN THE LINE OF HIM AND HE WASN'T

EVEN A JEW.

IT'S A CRAZY LETTER.

>> Stephen: ARE YOU A JEW?

>> NO STEERNTLE NEITHER AM I SO THAT WORKS FOR ME.

[ LAUGHTER ]

WHEN YOU DIE, NOT SOON I HOPE, WHEN YOU DIE ARE YOU GOING TO WANT A PRIEST THERE TO GIVE YOU

LAST RITES?

>> NO.

>> Stephen: WHY?

>> BECAUSE IT'S AN INVENTED SACRAMENT THAT HAD NO FOUNDATION IN THE EARLY CHURCH.

THE PRAYER OF THE BODY OF CHRIST IS A PRAYER OF ALL MY FELLOW CHRISTIANS.

I'D LIKE A PRIVATE OR ANY OTHER CHRISTIAN TO BE THERE PRAYING WITH ME.

HE'S A BROTHER IN CHRIST BUT HE'S NOT THE ONLY CONDUIT OF GOD'S GRACE.

>> Stephen: PRIEST HAVE DEDICATED THEIR LIVES TO THIS?

>> WELL, THEY SAY SO.

>> Stephen: WOULD YOU RATHER NO PRIESTS AT ALL.

>> YES.

>> Stephen: WHAT ABOUT POPE?

>> AREN'T THEY A PRIEST?

>> Stephen: A SUPERPRIEST.

WOULD YOU LIKE IT TO GO BENEDICT THE 16th TO NOBODY THE FIRST.

>> VERY GOOD IDEA.

>> Stephen: IS THERE ANY VALUE TO THE PROOFTHOOD YOU THINK WE WOULD BE LOSING IF WE GOT RID OF

ALL PRIESTS?

>> LEADERSHIP IN THE COMMUNITY, PROTESTANT AND CATHOLIC IS ALWAYS GOOD.

THE PRIESTS CAN DO THAT.

THAT'S FINE.

TEACH THE BIBLE.

YOU TEACH THE BIBLE.

>> Stephen: YEAH, ON THIS SHOW.

[LAUGHTER]

WHERE DO YOU GO AFTER THIS?

THE BARNES AND NOBLE IN HELL?

[LAUGHTER]

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

>> I PRAY NOT.

>> Stephen: YOU PRAY NOT, SO DO I.

GARRY WILLS, EVERYBODY.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

THE BOOK IS "WHY PRIESTS" WE'LL BE