Alex Gibney

  • Aired:  06/04/13
  •  | Views: 6,700

Academy Award-winning director Alex Gibney discusses Bradley Manning's WikiLeaks trial and the Obama administration's crackdown on whistleblowers. (5:44)

>> WELCOME BACK, EVERYBODY,

MY GUEST TONIGHT IS AN

ACADEMY AWARD-WINNING

DIRECTOR WHOSE NEW FILM IS

CALLED WE STEAL SECRETS.

THE STORY OF WIKI LEAKS.

HOW.

PLEASE WELCOME ALEX GIBNY.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

HEY, ALEX.

GOOD TO SEE YOU, THANK FORCE

COMING ON.

OKAY, AS I SAID, YOU ARE AN

ACADEMY AWARD-WINNING

DOCUMENTARY FILMMAKER.

YOUR FILMS INCLUDE TAXIES OF

THE DARKSIDE, CLIENT NINE,

THE RISE AND FALL OF ELIOT

SPITZER, MEAH MAXIMA CULPA,

SILENCE IN THE EYE OF GOD,

AND ENRON ITS SMARTEST GUYS

IN THE ROOM.

YOUR NEW FILM CALLED WE

STEAL SECRETS THE STORY OF

WIKI LAEKS IN THEATRES NOW,

ON DEMAND JUNE 7th.

WE STEAL SECRETS, ABOUT

WIKILEAKS, ARE YOU IN THIS

DISCUSSION TONIGHT GOING TO

SPILL ANY STATE SECRETS THAT

COULD GET A BAG POPPED OVER

MY HEAD AND GET ME DRAGGED

OFF TO GUANTANAMO.

>> NO, I DON'T THINK SO.

>> Stephen: YOU DON'T THINK

SO.

>> I DON'T THINK SO BUT YOU

KNOW, WE STEAL SECRETS IS

ACTUALLY A PHRASE SAID BY

FORMER CIA DIRECTOR MICHAEL

HAYDEN.

HE LOOKED AT ME AND SAID

ALEX, WE STEAL SECRETS,

THAT'S WHAT WE DO.

>> Stephen: THE CIA DOES.

>> CORRECT.

>> Stephen: THEY'RE LICENCE

FOOD DO SO.

>> SEEMINGLY SO.

>> Stephen: ARE YOU MAKING

EQUIVALENCY BETWEEN THE CIA,

THE OFFICIAL INTELLIGENCE

AGENCY OF THE UNITED STATES,

AND SOME CLOWN LIKE JULIAN A

SANG AND BADLY MANNING, A

KNOWN CRIMINAL WHO STOLE

THESE STATE SECRETS AND

LEAKED THEM TO THE WORLD AND

POSSIBLY TO OUR ENEMIES AND

ENDANGERED AMERICAN LIVES.

>> BRADLEY MANNING IS TO YOU

BEING CHARGED WITH AIDING

THE ENEMY WHICH IS

EQUIVALENT TO TREASON.

HE PLED GUILTY TO LEAK THE

SECRETS.

AND THE SECRETS HE LEAKED

DID A LOT OF GOOD.

>> Stephen: EXPLAIN TO

PEOPLE BEFORE WE GET AHEAD

OF OURSELVE WAS BRADLEY

MANNING IS AND WHAT HE DID,

FOR JULY YAN ASSANGE.

>> BRADLEY MANNING WAS AN

ARMY PRIVATE.

HE WAS IN IRAQ, DEPLOYED IN

IRAQ.

AND AT SOME POINT IN 2010 HE

LEAKED A VIDEO ABOUT THE

APACHE GUNSHIP WHICH KILLED

A REUTERS JOURNALIST AND

ALSO SOME WAR LOGS FROM IRAQ

AND AFGHANISTAN AND ABOUT

250,000 STATE DEPARTMENT

CABLES.

>> Stephen: OKAY.

>> THESE WERE LEAKED TO

WIKILEAKS THEN WIKILEAKS

PARTNERED WITH "THE NEW YORK

TIMES" AND THE GUARDIAN AND

A GERMAN SMAING TO PUBLISH

THESE ALL OVER THE WORLD.

>> Stephen: ARE YOU ARGUING

THAT HE SHOULD NOT BE ON

TRIAL FOR WHAT HE DID?

>> HE PLED GUILTY TO LEAKING

THESE SECRETS.

IT IS WHAT I WOULD CALL AN

ACT OF CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE.

HE MAY HAVE BEEN SOMEWHAT

NAIVE ABOUT THE EXTENT TO

WHICH THESE SECRETS WOULD BE

LEAKED ALL OVER THE WORLD.

BUT I DO THINK THAT HE HAD A

SENSE THAT SOME VERY BAD

STUFF WAS GOING ON IN IRAQ

AN AFGHANISTAN AND THE

AMERICAN PUBLIC NEEDED TO

KNOW ABOUT.

AND HE FELT THAT SOMEBODY

SHOULD PUBLISH THEM.

>> Stephen: SO HE THOUGHT HE

WAS DOING THE RIGHT THING.

>> INDEED.

>> Stephen: EVEN THOUGH IT

MIGHT BE AGAINST THE LAW FOR

HIM TO DO IT, HE HAD TO DO

THAT THING BECAUSE IT WAS

THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> Stephen: AND HE SHOULD

PAY A PRICE FOR THAT.

>> INDEED.

HE SAID-- HE IS GOING TO PAY

A PRICE FOR IT.

>> Stephen: IF YOU THINK IT

IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO BUT

AGAINST THE LAW YOU COULD

STILL DO IT AND THEN JUST

PAY THE PRICE AFTERWARDS AND

SAY THAT IS THE PRICE I GIVE

FOR MY COUNTRY THE SAME WAY

THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION KNEW

IT WAS THE RANGE THIS TO DO

TO TORTURE PEOPLE AND NOW

THEY HAVE ALL GONE TO JAIL.

>> NO.

>> Stephen: NO, I THINK

BIN-- A FAIR AMOUNT.

>> I'M PRETTY SURE NOBODY

WENT TO JAIL ABOUT IT.

>> Stephen: MAYBE DO A

DOCUMENTARY ABOUT THAT ONE.

>> A GOOD THOUGHT.

>> Stephen: NOW WHAT ABOUT

JULIAN ASSANGE HERE, THE

GHOST, AND I DON'T MEAN JUST

THE PAILNESS OF HIS SKIN.

>> HARD TO FIND THE GUY,

HARD TO GET TO.

DID YOU INTERVIEW HIM FOR

THIS DOCUMENTARY?

>> NO, I DIDN'T.

HE REFUSED TO BE

INTERVIEWED.

HE WANTED MONEY.

AND THEN AFTER I SAID I

WOULDN'T PAY HIM, HE SAID

WELL HOW ABOUT YOU SPY ON

SOME OF THE OTHER INTERVIEW

SUBJECTS.

AND I SAID WELL I'M NOT

GOING TO DO THAT.

>> Stephen: WAIT, WAIT, HE

WANTED YOU TO SPY ON, WHO

DID HE WANT TO YOU SPY ON.

>> ALL THE OTHER INTERVIEW

SUBJECTS I WAS TALKING TO

AND REPORT BACK TO HIM.

>> Stephen: SO YOU WOULD BE

WORKING FOR HIM.

>> RIGHT.

>> Stephen: WAS HE WILLING

TO PAY YOU TO WORK FOR HIM?

>> THAT WAS A GOOD QUESTION,

I SHOULD HAVE ASKED HIM

THAT.

>> Stephen: NOW I HAD HIM ON

MY SHOW IN 2010 AND IT WAS

FREE.

(LAUGHTER)

HE ATE LIKE HALF A CHEESE

TRAY, YOU KNOW.

IT WAS NICE.

WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE ASKED

HIM HAD YOU THE CHANCE?

>> I WANTED TO HAVE HIM WALK

THROUGH EVERYTHING THAT HE

HAD DONE, THE PROCESS BY

WHICH HE DECIDED TO COME UP

WITH THIS FRANKLY A VERY

GOOD IDEA WHICH IS THIS

TRANSNATIONAL PUBLISHING

MECHANISM WHEREBY PEOPLE

COULD LEAK SECRET AS

NONMUSSLY TO A WEB SITE THAT

WOULD NOT BE BEHOLDEN TO

POLITICAL PRESSURES AROUND

THE WORLD.

I WANTED TO FIND OUT HOW HE

CAME UP WITH THE IDEA AND

HOW HE PUT IT UP TO EFFECT.

>> Stephen: YOU SAY THE

OBAMA ADMINISTRATION IS

TENANTMENT TO CRIMINALIZE OG

INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISM.

WHAT DOW MEAN BY THAT.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS

HAPPENING IS THE OBAMA

ADMINISTRATION HAS NOW

PROSECUTED MORE

WHISTLE-BLOWERS THAN ALL

PREVIOUS ADMINISTRATIONS

COMBINED.

>> Stephen: AND THAT'S GOOD

OR BAD.

>> NASS'S BAD.

>> Stephen: YOU DON'T THINK

SPIES, ES MEANAGE, RIGHT

THERE IN THE NAME, YOU

SHOULDN'T BE PROSECUTING

SPIES THAT IS WHAT YOU ARE

SAYING.

>> I AM SAYING THEY

SHOULDN'T BE PROSECUTING

WHISTLE-BLOWERS AS SPIES.

>> Stephen: WHO GETS TO SAY

WHAT IS A WHISTLE-BLOWER AND

WHAT IS A SPY,.

>> WELL, I GUESS THE

PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED

STATES GETS TO SAY.

>> Stephen: DAMN STRAIGHT.

>> THAT'S WHY YOU NEED A

REPUBLICAN IN THERE.

>> WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH

FOR JOINING ME.

ALEC, WE STEAL SECRETS,

WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.

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